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18 March 2008 @ 07:37 am
Question  
Is selling my perm account against TOS anything? I originally got it because this is how I keep up with my friends, but my friends aren't using it anymore :( :( :( It seems that someone else could get more use out of a perm account than I would.
 
 
 
Johnwibbble on March 18th, 2008 01:40 pm (UTC)
Yes, it is. Try and sell it - and get caught, of course - and you'll get it suspended.
just another star in the skylittlestarletta on March 18th, 2008 02:36 pm (UTC)
how could he possibly get caught when he posts here in this open community?
Johnwibbble on March 18th, 2008 02:43 pm (UTC)
I hear that LJ has spies everywhere.
Jenniferjenny_zzz on March 18th, 2008 02:53 pm (UTC)
*ahem* She...

And I can't really tell if you're meaning to be sarcastic, sarcasm doesn't transmit itself well over text, but there's a reason I asked instead of saying "hey, I'm selling my account, who wants it?" I wasn't sure it was alright or not. Now that I know it's not, that option is off the table. Thanks.
just another star in the sky: Wordy: You're a Huge Bitchlittlestarletta on March 18th, 2008 02:55 pm (UTC)
*ahem*
Knorg Knorgsson: Eat Mecrackpig on March 18th, 2008 05:41 pm (UTC)
NO! YOU!

Jenniferjenny_zzz on March 19th, 2008 12:35 am (UTC)
Wow. I only came here to ask a question, and I get that icon and sarcasm out the ass, eh?

Guess I'll ask my questions elsewhere from now on...
Philip Newtonpne on March 18th, 2008 01:40 pm (UTC)
I'd suggest opening up a ticket with the Abuse Prevention Team, since they're the ones who can tell you for sure.

My unofficial guess is that section X of the TOS is what applies, though, it's not OK to charge for an account.

(Not even sure whether giving away an account for free would be fine, though -- ask the APT to be sure.)
ZJRwinterknight on March 18th, 2008 01:47 pm (UTC)
The other problem is that unless you give away the email address associated with the account, the other person can never be guaranteed to have complete control over it. There's been problems in the past with this. It's not recommended to buy or take over another account.
Up Too Late: stairwaysthisdaydreamer on March 18th, 2008 09:01 pm (UTC)
But you can change what email account is associated with the journal. I had to change mine when hotmail decided that everything sent from LiveJournal was spam and blocked it.
Philip Newtonpne on March 18th, 2008 09:11 pm (UTC)
Yes, but LiveJournal remembers the previous email addresses associated with the account[*], and you can always have a password reset email sent to a previous address as well.

So if you give away your account, you'll always be able to get it back by having the password reset email sent to your previous address.

It's possible to delete addresses from that list of previous addresses, but only by switching back to an older address.

This is useful if someone steals your account and adds their own email address: you can have a password reset email sent to your address (which is on file as a previous address for that account), then change the email address back to the old one, then delete the intruder's email address from the account.

However, since you have to change to a previous address in order to delete a later one, this means you can never delete the first email address the account ever had, since there's no earlier address you could change to. So the very first address will always remain on file as a valid previous address.

[*] To be precise: LiveJournal remembers previous email addresses if they were validated (you clicked a link in an email sent there to confirm the address was yours). However, since accounts with unvalidated email addresses are rather limited (IIRC, they can't post comments, nor can they post entries in communities), most email addresses will be validated these days, I would assume.
C Eagle: bc_eagle on March 19th, 2008 11:36 am (UTC)
While this is good in that one way, the plan wasn't thought very carefully. People's emails tend to change from time to time, usually when they move to a new ISP. The backbone of this plan breaks down if the initial email is a permanent capture method.
Newer methods using 'secret questions' might be better to ensure that stealing accounts doesn't happen.
lied_ohne_wortelied_ohne_worte on March 19th, 2008 12:53 pm (UTC)
Newer methods using 'secret questions' might be better to ensure that stealing accounts doesn't happen.

I honestly doubt that. AFAIK, LiveJournal is not using "secret questions" intentionally because they are usually not "secret" or secure at all. If you look at the kind of questions that sites usually ask (mother's maiden name, first street you lived in, first telephone number you had, etc.), that information is typically known to several other persons, including RL friends, family members, ex-partners. Those are the exact persons whom I would suspect of trying to break into accounts far more often than random internet strangers who do not know that information. Even if a site allows users to set their own questions, few people would probably set something that no other person could know, rather than going with the "what is my first name" option.
C Eagle: bc_eagle on March 19th, 2008 10:23 pm (UTC)
Good point... just trying to come up with some ideas that are more secure and effective than using an original email account that may not exist anymore..
Philip Newtonpne on March 19th, 2008 06:05 pm (UTC)
Newer methods using 'secret questions' might be better

It depends - not only on how well the secret question is chosen (nothing easily googleable, for example, such as "what is my dog called"), but also on how easy it is to remember the answer you gave, three or five or ten years later. (Though perhaps that ties in to "how well the question is chosen"; an ideal question will be one that you will always remember the answer to.)
C Eagle: bc_eagle on March 19th, 2008 10:33 pm (UTC)
Absolutely, and now that many banks and online bill-pays services and ISPs and such are using 'secret question' methods (I don't say it's perfect, just that it's a fact), it's important that this is a consideration. Also knowing that I've had half a dozen old emails vanish over ten years due to vanishing ISPs, it does sound slightly better than LiveJournal's method in comparison :)
ZJRwinterknight on March 18th, 2008 09:19 pm (UTC)
The first email account associated with the journal always maintains ultimate control over the journal. It's the way that they determine ownership of a journal. It's all recorded and requests emailed from the original address are always the final word.
Heather Joneszerocoolphreak on March 22nd, 2008 12:44 am (UTC)
What if that email address doesn't exist anymore?
ZJRwinterknight on March 22nd, 2008 12:45 am (UTC)
If you're talking about your own, you need to talk to LJ admin about working something out, if you can. If you're talking about the other person, you'd have to believe them. :( I've just seen too many people screwed over maliciously.
ZJRwinterknight on March 22nd, 2008 12:45 am (UTC)
Also, remember, if it doesn't exist anymore, you may never really have secure control over your account again.
Philip Newtonpne on March 22nd, 2008 07:01 am (UTC)
Especially if it doesn't exist now but can exist again in the future.

For example, Hotmail will let other people take discarded usernames after a certain period (90 days?), and I imagine many other places have similar policies.
Philip Newtonpne on March 18th, 2008 02:23 pm (UTC)
Good one.
Jenniferjenny_zzz on March 18th, 2008 02:54 pm (UTC)
Thank you.
吾畫遍行天下偽造居多bad on March 18th, 2008 01:53 pm (UTC)
no resale of service is allowed (LiveJournal TOS, X)

but you can gift your account to anyone you wish :)
Jenniferjenny_zzz on March 18th, 2008 02:55 pm (UTC)
Can I gift my perm status? I didn't see an option to... but I might have missed it.
Philip Newtonpne on March 18th, 2008 03:13 pm (UTC)
I'd suggest using the Contact Us form (option "Billing") to get in touch with the Account Payments people and ask them. (Or open a support request, though I imagine it'd get moved over to Account Payments.)

I know when I got my Permanent Account, I talked to them about getting the remainder of my Paid time gifted to someone else.
Up Too Late: Twainthisdaydreamer on March 18th, 2008 09:05 pm (UTC)
The account is what has the permanent status, so whoever has the account is a permanent member.

So far as I can tell, all you have to do to change who has the account is to give the other person the password, then change the email address associated with the account to their email address, then they can change the password. That neatly sidesteps all of the concerns in the FAQ link that someone else posted.
Philip Newtonpne on March 18th, 2008 09:12 pm (UTC)
So far as I can tell, all you have to do to change who has the account is to give the other person the password, then change the email address associated with the account to their email address, then they can change the password. That neatly sidesteps all of the concerns in the FAQ link that someone else posted.

Nope - as the FAQ says, "The only way to keep your account secure is to make sure that you and you alone control the first-validated email address on the account."

Whoever controls the first-validated email address can always get the account back, no matter how many email address changes there are later.
Shadow/Brookekengr on March 18th, 2008 11:49 pm (UTC)
Of course, if that first address no longer *exists*...
(this may be the case with my journal, as I may have been using an address in a domain that no longer exists)
prince on March 18th, 2008 03:03 pm (UTC)
has someone actually offered to buy jenny_zzz? seems like it would be smart to just start a new account by altering the name a little... or maybe i'm missing something. oh wait. it's not jenny_zzz you're asking about :D